Can Non-Believing Friends Be Saved? | Fr. Patrick Briscoe & Fr. Joseph-Anthony Kress

January 30, 2025

Fr. Patrick: This is Father Patrick Briscoe. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: This is Father Joseph-Anthony Kress. 

Fr. Patrick: Welcome to Godsplaining. Thanks to all who support us. If you enjoy the show, please consider making a monthly donation on Patreon. Be sure to like and subscribe to Godsplaining wherever you listen to your podcasts. Okay, Father Joseph-Anthony…

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Oh you are coming in hot out of here, let’s go!

Fr. Patrick: As we jump into this episode, I am gonna propose a number of Catholic hymns to you. And you just answer very simply, yes or no. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Ah, okay, cool. 

Fr. Patrick: Okay, “Here I am, Lord.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Oh, yeah. 

Fr. Patrick: “Little Mortal Flesh Keeps Silent.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Of course, yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “Salve Regina.”  

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “Eagle’s Wings.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Uh..eh..no… 

Fr. Patrick: Ooh, “Be Not Afraid.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Oh, man, I don’t really like it but I’m gonna have to say yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “The King of Love My Shepherd Is.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: No, actually. 

Fr. Patrick: “Immaculate Mary.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “Christ Be Our Light.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Oh! There’s a nostalgia to that, but I wanna say no. 

Fr. Patrick: Ooh, “The Summons.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: No. (laughing) 

Fr. Patrick: Ooh, not even a little bit? I hear John Paul II second crying somewhere. He Loved that one.

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: I know. But I don’t. I don’t. 

Fr. Patrick: “Come, Holy Ghost.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “Sacrament Most Holy.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: “Faith of our Fathers.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes.

Fr. Patrick: “Servant Song.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Ooh. Great question. I want to say yeah. 

Fr. Patrick: “Blessed Are They.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: “Blessed Are They”… No. 

Fr. Patrick: “Take And Eat.” 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: No. 

Fr. Patrick: “One Bread, One Body.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: No. 

Fr. Patrick: Okay, last one. “Your Grace is Enough.”

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. (laughing) – Oh, yes, absolutely. There’s nostalgia in that one too. Going back to the college days. 

Fr. Patrick: All of that, all of that was a good warmup. Yes?

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: True. 

Fr. Patrick: Or no. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: Can my non Catholic non-believing friends be saved? Yes or no?

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yeah! 

Fr. Patrick: Beautiful. Let’s jump into that because that’s gonna take some explaining. I think, you know, there’s some of these.  

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Some explaining to do.  

Fr. Patrick: While, we might say like, well, you know, there’s no disputing taste when it comes to our opinions of sacred or the surgical music with respect to doctrine, there’s plenty of reasons to dispute. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. 

Fr. Patrick: And plenty of reasons to believe one or another thing is right. So this phrase, this question, yes, this yes, or no question, can I non-believe in friends be saved has a lot packed into it. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Very much so. 

Fr. Patrick: It seems like it’s a very simple question, right? So we’re going to parse this sucker, I think. So first, Fr. Joseph-Anthony, what is it that we mean when we say be saved. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yeah. It’s, you know, I think we look back to who, who’s the proper One that saves, like who does the saving, right? And that’s an act which is proper to God Himself, right? He’s the one who redeems. He, He’s created all things from nothingness andHeretains that power and authority andHeexercises it in a way thatHerecreates,Heredeems in that. And so when we talk about who is the one who is doing the saving, well that’s ultimately God’s work. AndHecan dispense that authority in that power in the ways thatHesees fit, right? And so, now, we can start to look at how He has seen fit to share that authority, share that power of redemption and sendingHisown Beloved Son to take on our flesh and to suffer and to die for us, but also then to experience that death and to rise from the grave. So now we’ve seen that the most fitting way for our salvation to take place in God’s mind was the sending ofHisSon, Jesus Christ. And then our participation in that redemption is throughHisSon. And so we can see all of this taking place. And while at the same time saying that he’s never lost that authority and that power. And so those who are, you know, when we talk about, you know, who can be saved or how does that happen, I think sometimes we can lose the sense that it’s GodHimself who saves you, right? That’sHisauthority, that’sHispower. And ultimately, it’s mysterious, right? At the end of the day, it’s a mystery. And so there are kind of clear and defined and kind of definite, maybe, yeah, clear and definite ways for that salvation to be articulated in a demonstrated. And that’s for actually our guarantee and our benefit, but can the Lord work outside of those ways? And this is easy. So like, can the Lord forgive sins outside of a sacramental economy? And the answer is yes. He’s God.Hecan do that. But the sacramental economy is a gift given to us for our benefit to be to have us be able to be confident and rest assured that our sins are forgiven, and thus we are participating in that redemption throughHisson, Jesus Christ. 

Fr. Patrick: Is the ordinary means of God’s grace, right? I love that phrase very much, meaning it’s the reliable means. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes, absolutely. 

Fr. Patrick: Now when we’re looking for those graces to be conveyed. We know they are being conveyed through this Sacrament of Confession. I think implicit in this is a question we talked about this before on the podcast in different episodes. But this question about the understanding of salvation, of certain of our Protestant brothers and sisters, we’ll ask Catholics, are you saved? And there are certain Protestants who believe that salvation consists in professing belief in the saving power of the name of Jesus, right? 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Absolutely. 

Fr. Patrick: So the proposition is something like, do you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Savior? And you say yes, and then according to this definition of salvation, you are therefore saved. Whereas when you pose this question, to a Catholic, it is a little bit more complicated, right? Because we say, well, I hope I’m on the way to salvation. But our understanding of salvation is that it’s something that can be lost due to malice, due to sin, that we can, in fact, reject God. And then it’s not as simple as ascending to a proposition once and for all that salvation is the working out of that grace in our lives which as you were pointing out has a number of ways. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: So I mean, yeah, just to pause there for a second, why is that so important? Well, because we are physical beings, we have bodies, we live in time and space, right? And so our decision’s not a once forever decision. With each new moment, we have a new kind of maybe bevy of knowledge because we gain knowledge to our physical senses, right? And so that gives us the opportunity to make another choice and then another decision. We don’t have this, we’re not angels, right? We don’t, angels have the great gift of having a pure intellect, and they don’t have a body. And so their one decision is a once for all decision. So for the angel or if you approached an angel and said, do you take the Lord Jesus as your Lord and personal Savior? And they said, yes, well then that’s it. But we’re human beings. And so we have repeated actions, we have repeated decisions to make. And that’s why the unfolding of our life, like you said, we can actually, yes, we can lose salvation. But further subsequent actions, decisions, professions of faith, reiterate and continue us participating in that redemptive work that the Lord has invited us into and shared with us throughHisbenevolence and generosity. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, it’s a good point to underscore, right? That we are way fairs. We are pilgrims and that all of us are on this Christian journey. And you could roll your eyes with that. I suspect most Godsplaining listeners would, right? Yeah, man. The journey of faith. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: I’m a pilgrim. I am Luce. 

Fr. Patrick: I too feel like throwing up at this very thought of talking about my faith journey. But the point is that all of us are in fact moving at times closer to and at times further from God and on the rise of our life. And ultimately, salvation consists in having arrived at that place where we see God once and for all in the beatific vision. So I think that would be the domestic argument that salvation consists ultimately in finding oneself at that moment where we see God face to face. And that the ultimate rejection therefore of salvation consists in arriving in hell, which is the freely chosen rejection of God to be separated from God for all eternity. So I think that’s important for the stakes. And before I leave this question, what does it mean to be saved before I leave this bond? I want to underscore your point too, because there is a sense that we need to be a little bit agnostic about the state of any individual. So. You haven’t really know that. The Catechism underlines that, right? That’s paragraph 1861 where you’ve just got this need to rely on God’s mercy and to just pause beforeHismajesty andHismystery. Okay, now what about this point? Then we’re making, okay, so we began the episode asking this question, can my non-believing friends be saved? What is the word talking about when we’re talking about the particular question of a non-believer? And why is that different than asking like, well, my other Catholic friends be saved? 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yeah, I’m, you know, I maybe my experience of this kind of question is, is in a maybe different format or maybe a little nuance format. I know here, people may be approached it this way of like, oh, well, I’m a good person, right? Like maybe that’s, that’s what’s necessary for salvation. It’s like, oh, I’m, you know, I’m a generally a good person. So I’ll be, I’ll be okay type of a thing. Like I don’t necessarily believe your things. I don’t follow your rules. It’s enough for me just to be a good person. And I’m not gonna believe, you know, anything that you propose in front of me because I’m just gonna at the end of the day, try to be a good person as long as I try to be a good person or as long as I’m a good person, I’ll be fine. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, it’s like that kind of claim of like a universalism that’s like higher than Christianity. And there’s some kind of like other ultimate way that is beyond, and as long as we’re all kind of adhering to that, that’s all we can come to sing.  

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: It’s trying to approach Christianity as less of an encounter with God, but more about a method or way of life. And it’s a good way of life. It’s a good way to live to be good people. Like it has nice things to say. Like the golden rule, do unto others as you would like them to do unto you. Like that’s a nice thing to do that helps me to be a good person. If that works for you, that’s fine. But I’m just going to at the end of the day…So it’s kind of a distilling in maybe in a negative way, a reducing of Christianity to, it just helps us to be good people. And at the end of the day, that’s all that matters. In reality is, no, no, no, we don’t save ourselves. We are in need of a Savior. We may be if by our words actions have put us into the pit, we may have dug the hole, and now we can’t get out we need a savior once again who is the one who’s properly doing the act of saving? We can’t save ourselves. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, it turns out being in communion with the living God is the only thing that matters.

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Exactly and so when I approach that kind of nuance or a different approach to that of, okay, non-believers, like, are they able to be saved or things like that? Is it enough just to be a good person? At the end of the day, no. Like, you have to believe in God as your Savior. And precisely once again, Jesus Christ as the sole redeemer there is that. Now, we can start to split hairs and start to talk about, well, what is the responsibility of the individual? Have they heard the gospel? Have they heard about this person Jesus before? To understand or have that kind of encounter? Have they only encountered it in a very manipulative or misunderstood approach to it and things like that. And then we can kind of start to get into some of the culpability sides of it all and how the Lord inHismercy andHismystery will work in those situations. But at the end of the day, is it enough just to be trying to be a good individual, live natural virtue? Or do we actually need a divine intervention of a God as a Savior? 

Fr. Patrick: Right. Well, Father, Bonaventure would say, proclaim the Gospel. It must be announced. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: It has to be announced. 

Fr. Patrick: People must be evangelized. So I think that’s true. Now, we do have some data, you know, that are that are consoling on this point, right? We’ve got, for example, John 3:17, for God to not send His son to condemn the world, but the world might be saved through him. I think that inspires us. We’ve got this great verse from Timothy 1, Timothy 2:4 God desires all men to be saved. These are the kinds of witnesses from Scripture that point to God’s loving hopefulness that all men would embrace it’s saving truth. And I think we can go even further and we can say, well, God in fact does offer the means for salvation to every person. So Romans, chapter 2, 14 and 16, you know, has this beautiful track insisting that God’s law is written on every human heart Which means that every heart has the ability to respond right to the love of God and The St. Thomas Aquinas would say as you know, if other Jews man thing that God gives sufficient grace to all for salvation, which is With all of that is big language, which means that the human heart could reject God’s law, or that the human heart could turn away from the grace of salvation which are being offered. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: But I think that makes the, I don’t know, the imposition of this need to evangelize so much more accessible. Saying that, oh, every person that I encounter actually has the capacity to receive the Good News. There’s nothing that precludes them from being incapable of hearing the gospel. By God’s grace, becauseHedoes desire all men to be saved, they’re capable of receiving that and having the grace to encounter their Savior. And that just because they’re from a different geographic or cultural background or maybe have their own kind of past and their own personal history with different religions or different faiths does not preclude them from the ability, it’s once again, one decision’s not predeterminate of the rest of the future. And they’ve made this other decision, I guess they’re not worthy of the Gospel. And it’s like, no, no, no, no, we still retain that. And the Lord does desire every single individual to encounter His redemption and salvation and mercy. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, I think this is very important. And I’d like for the argument you’re making here from the evangelical motive, right, which is that we don’t want to say this is unnecessary because we know we have to announce the gospel, right? We want to give a real value to that work. So therefore, it’s just reasonable to believe that it actually does something. The Great Commission, right at the end of Matthew’s Gospels, Jesus, whenHegives the Great Commission, says, “Go and teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son of the Holy Spirit.”Hedoes not say, “It’s okay if some of you don’t believe in me.” Like that is nowhere in the Gospel. Jesus in the Gospel, Jesus is making, when you’re paying attention to our Lord’s words, Jesus is making very absolute claims of himself. I am the Son of God. And he’s revealingHimself to us, especially John’s gospel, right? As a new law giver, the kind of Aaron, Moses, the one who reveals the son who reveals the father. And it’s not optional. It’s very clear that it’s not optional. These are these decisive revelations from the Lord. So we do therefore have this impetus, this compelling reason to evangelize, to share that fullness of joy and truth, which is only in our Lord Jesus Christ and to cooperate with that work in others lives, expands that joy as it were. It brings it, brings it greater brilliance and that kind of charity that redounds upon itself. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yeah, I mean, and those two quotes that you brought up, the one from Aquinas and one of the other previous ones is where the Lord does give us the sufficient grace…

Fr. Patrick: Oh, sure. Romans, Romans, yeah. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: And he’s attentive to who we are in our states of life. So He gives us the grace and the dispositions that He creates us with in our nature, while at the same time, attentive to our surroundings, the culture that we grow up in, the geography, the time and history in which we grow up, or the time and history which we live, that the Lord is not inattentive to these things. AndHeis moving each individual person given that structure, hopefully closer and closer to encounter Him, right? And it’s at the same time we have freedom so we can reject that or not, but He’s just not inattentive and saying, well, that’s unfortunate that there, like,Hegives us sufficient grace given the context and where we are and our approximate surroundings in all of its many facets to truly have a deep encounter with him. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, exactly. We can hold these things. We can hold them even though it seems like there’s attention. We can hold them in tandem. We can say God is merciful. He does not force salvation, butHeoffers it to all who can freely refuse it. Right. And at the same time, we trust in God’s perfect knowledge andHisperfect love for every soul. Right. So what are some takeaways here that you think of, someone who’s listening to this episode and saying, well, I tuned in here because I’ve got this non-believing friend that I’m deeply concerned about. What kinds of things should we as Catholics be encouraged to do in that situation or towards that person that they’re working for? 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: I kind of have three thoughts in that way. And the first is recognizing that…

Fr. Patrick: Hit them with the Summa. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: [laughing] Wapatow! The first thought is that this other person who may not believe right now, they may be agnostic, they may be atheists, they may have practiced a different religion or anything along those lines or maybe just floating through the malaise of our 21st century culture, whatever. I don’t care. This other person is loved by God, right? They carry and bearHisimage and just like each and every one of us, we’ve lostHislikeness and sin. And so this act of salvation, redemption is likeness restoration, but this other bears the image of God and God truly loves them. And so we should too. And if we love them, we should want them to have the fullness of that encounter as well. And so that then pushes us to the second thing is to be unafraid to proclaim our own relationship with the Lord, right? Not necessarily to… There’s an urgency to that. This person doesn’t know the Lord, and that this person doesn’t have the fullness of truth, or maybe has rejected it in multiple ways and in variety of ways, but there’s an urgency to proclaim the reality of who God is and who this other person is in that love and to be pushed in that way to proclaim the Gospel. Right. But then the manner of which we do that, I, you know, once again, you’ve heard me say this before, I’ve set it on the podcast many a times. I go back to Monsignor James Shea whenHetalks about from Christendom apostolic mission, recognizing we are in an apostolic time, an apostolic epic of the Church, and that the Truth is no longer able to be imposed via authority. The Truth has to be invited via an encounter in relationship. So if you have a relationship with this person, claim your Christianity, claim your faith, give witness to it, but invite the other to experience that as well via an invitation. Right? You know, come, hey, this is, you know, I’ve encountered the living God. It’s not the God of the dead. He’s the God of the living. And I’ve encountered him. And I know He loves me. I know He loves you and I love you. I want to share that encounter. So I’m inviting you to share that in this moment. And they may accept, they may reject. Can I speak to my encounter with this Lord who too rose from the grave and suffered for your sins as well as mine? Can I share that? Let’s talk about that. I’d love, I would love to share that with you. Would you be willing to enter into this with me? That’s an invitation to relationship of which I can give witness to. So I think those two things, if we can hold all of that together, then that opens up a beautiful relationship of which we share in both a greater love of neighbor and love of God himself. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, I do think there’s a great temptation today to say, well, you know, all religions are just kind of saying the same thing and therefore to diminish or to otherwise discourage that evangelical impulse, you know, which we have. And I do think we have to reject that. The Church impels us because of what Jesus has revealed to us through the Church and we should therefore have a kind of boldness. But to your point that that kind of boldness is only going to be effective insofar as it’s mediated. I think through that loving witness, through, through a especially meaningful relationship. You know, I think on, loving witness, through especially meaningful relationship. I think that gone would be the days where shouting from three corners, you know, had any real impact on someone and that it’s really that witness to a friend about what the most important things are in life. So again, I think the way that we can allow the Evangelical Impulse to be diminished is by being reductive in our relationships. And we can shy away from differences, you know, to skip Mass on a Holy Day, for example, or to hide when we’re observing with the fasts of the Church. And those are actually opportunities for encounter. And rather than diminishing or hiding your identity, we should lean into it, we should lean into it. And that’s what extends invitation and relationship. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: I also think there’s, we have to get to a point where we embody something ourselves or maybe ingrain it into who we are. And that is a reverence for the wisdom of God as He is chosen to share His goodness in His redemption with us. Right? The wisdom of God seems like the foolishness of men. And so this may seem ridiculous that this one man, Jesus Christ is the redeemer of all human history and humanity, right? But in a certain sense, we have to kind of reverence that and to be convicted of it, but also that means that we reference howHehas shared this kind of redemption with us in the church through the sacraments and all of these things. I didn’t have to be, but the Lord sees that as the most fitting. So I have a certain reference for that. And I want to invite others into that. Now, like as I said earlier, like can the Lord work outside of that? Yes, but it’s less definite. It’s more mysterious. And there’s a certain kind of recklessness to playing upon that risk. And so we have to kind of reverence what the Lord has given us as a gift. One of my favorite lines from St. John Paul II and one of His letters whenHewas announced as the Holy Father,Hisfirst letter diary entry thatHewrote.Hefinished it by saying, “I am a debtor.” In realizing that we are debtors that have been received, that we’ve received this gift of redemption, and that is clear and definite path to that that is accessible to all because the Lord desires all to be saved. And so to approach the other with a reverence and a heart of gratitude for how the Lord has decided to unfold the redemption of humanity and to not let others kind of recklessly wander about and just in the hopes that, well, if they’re good enough, then maybe the Lord will be good to them. It’s like, the Lord’s given us this definite path. Let’s make sure that we’re dependent upon that. 

Fr. Patrick: Yeah, that’s right. And I think that that’s really important because that speaks to the kind of two urgent questions that are underneath this fundamental question about whether or not my non-believing friends will be saved. And they are, well, the follow-ups are, well, how can I talk to my friends about salvation then without sounding judgmental? 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Right. 

Fr. Patrick: And if you have this kind of gratitude and this sort of posture of humility before the received truths, then you’re not going to sound judgmental, especially when it’s coming out of a genuine place of love. And you’ve got that relationship with someone already built that you can rely on. And then the second question is, what do I do then about friends who have rejected my offer of faith, you know, my attempts at evangelization? And you know, to that end, you know, we simply say, stay the course right. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Love them. Love them! 

Fr. Patrick: You just keep doing it. Don’t give up on your friend. Don’t don’t therefore abandon this person. No, and you continue to continue to embody the mercy of the gospel that you would want to live down towards you. 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: There’s a beautiful reality that one, the Lord’s final words is that His final words on earth beforeHeascends to the right hand of the Father is thatHewill not abandon us.Hewill stay with us until the end of the age. That is a promise that I have found way too much comfort in throughout the entirety of my life. And so then to imitate that with our friends to not abandon them, even if they’ve rejected us, right? And while at the same time, being both patient and persistent, you know, every time I, I’m in the confessional hearing confessions, I am just radically aware of divine patients which look so different than human patients. You know, we continually return back to the sacrament, confession, time and time again with the same sins, and the Lord’s still patient with us. So if you continually invite this person, they continually say, “No,” there’s a certain divine patience to just keep receiving that. And then the Lord constantly is pursuing us. And so these small things that are kind of imitating GodHimself in His ability to never abandon,Hispatience to keep receiving a rejection, but just to continue on. And while at the same time, being persistent and keep offering the grace, just like the Lord every time we reject him in our sins,Hecontinually offers a grace of a compunction, the grace of repentance, so that we can return to him. Working in campus ministry, I mean, there’s stories upon stories upon stories of our students or our missionaries who lead Bible studies that will just keep inviting students to a Bible study and there’s always a reason not to. There’s always something else to do. But then eventually that persistence is just keep offering or they get ghosted all the time. Nobody responds. Nobody responds. And then that one time the person shows up and is like, oh, I’ve been a part of this group chat. I’ve been reading the scriptures along the, like you had no idea. I never responded, but yet no idea how important the fact that you never cut me out was to me. And so I think those are elements that we can start to imitate the LordHimself in our invitations and persistence to maybe a nonbeliever because we are convicted of who Jesus is. 

Fr. Patrick: Father Joseph-Anthony, I think that’s a great note to end this episode on, do you have any final thoughts you want to share about the question? 

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Yes. As I mentioned earlier, at the top of the episode, it’s the Lord Jesus who does the saving. He is the Savior. That’s His responsibility. That’s His action. And He also converts a heart. So if we’re trying to do all this activity or trying to do all these invitations and things outside of praying for those that we meet praying for those that the Lord has placed in our lives that may be we’re some kind of instrument of facilitating their encounter with the Lord himself, but if we’re trying to do all of that devoid from Entrusting them to His mercy because at the end of the day,He is the one that converts a heart.Heis the one that saves. We need to do more than anything pray. Pray for them. And so the Lord allows us to participate in their conversion or participate in their reversion, whatever it may be, praise Jesus. But all this activity that we’re talking about has to be undergirded by a deep prayer of asking the Lord to convert the heart. 

Fr. Patrick: Amen. Well, thanks for that. Because ultimately, that’s right. All of our good words…

Fr. Joseph-Anthony: Thank you. Yeah, I really appreciate you saying that on air, on the internet. 

Fr. Patrick: So thanks friends, turning to you, our listener, our viewer, for tuning in to this episode of Godsplaining. We appreciate your support. If you’d like to donate to our project, please consider becoming a monthly Patreon supporter. You can find information about that over at Godsplaining.org. On Godsplaining.org, you can also shop our merch and find information on upcoming Godsplaining events. We also ask that you would drop some comments in about this episode. You know, how have your evangelization attempts found success, when have they failed? Um, what, what do you think needs to be more clearly announced, um, as we, um, as we wind away through this pretty complex topic, actually. Um, so leave your comments there in the chat. We love hearing from you. If you would be so kind as to also like and subscribe to Godsplaining across our social media channels and wherever you listen to your podcast, we would be very much obliged. Friends, we also ask that you would pray for us and please know that we’re praying for you. God bless.